DHP Financial post of the week: Scams, Its hard enough keeping our hard earned money

[imported_Gman]

Without Mofo's trying to scam us out of it graemlins/cussing.gif

A very good friend tried to get me to sign up for "Prepaid Legal Services". Who wouldn't want access to lawyers for the typical things that may come up in your life. Kinda like a LMO (Lawyer Maintenance Organization) instead of HMO. We all can't afford to pay outright for great lawyers like Alan King, MHD and TAC right? Anyway my friends presentation sounded real good, too good. I gave him my standard response of "let me take a day or two to think about it and I will get back to ya". Thinking that if it turns out to be legit then I would sign up. I then proceeded to investigate Prepaid Legal Services and came up with all sorts of red flags. Basically a pyramid scheme where the company makes most of their money from people who sign up as sales people. They sell them kits and web sites with the promise that they are going to make lots of money. The fact was that most people who signed up to recieve "Prepaid Legal Services" dropped within the first year because they were not happy with the service. I also found a number of the sales people were mounting a class action lawsuit against the company for not getting paid their commission. :D Stay away from "Prepaid Legal Services" and shame on my friend. Actually he was just taken in and bought the bullshit hook line and sinker so I really can't blame him. Then again he did (like they all do) overstate the amount of money they are making from selling this stuff just to get you excited. So he's not totally innocent.

So please list some of the scams that we should know about so that we don't fall victim. We gotta protect our money. graemlins/grinyes.gif

-G

[Austin/Dallas]

A representative spoke to me over the phone in regards to a position with them doing /monitoring online product sales. I figured this would be a good part time do-at home- position.

Anyway the phone conversation went well and I was impressed, But then he asked me what type of credit card I would be using today.

"Credit Card" I asked, for what!! He responded it was just for legal reasons incase of misuse of the product.

I replied what product and hung up!!!

This is the second ad I've responded to in regards to a position that asked for a credit card. Is this new/old scam or is this a new wave of employment??

[Jamie 3:26]

Thanks G.I forwarded your post to a good friend of mine.He is currently involved in that scam.his guy was trying to get him to seel it also.Thanks again.

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by Austin/Dallas:
A representative spoke to me over the phone in regards to a position with them doing /monitoring online product sales. I figured this would be a good part time do-at home- position.

Anyway the phone conversation went well and I was impressed, But then he asked me what type of credit card I would be using today.

"Credit Card" I asked, for what!! He responded it was just for legal reasons incase of misuse of the product.

I replied what product and hung up!!!

This is the second ad I've responded to in regards to a position that asked for a credit card. Is this new/old scam or is this a new wave of employment?? Never tried any of the work at home schemes. My gut feeling about them were that they were scams. Thanks for the info. I should start asking people for their credit card numbers in order to become members of this site. When they ask why I will say " Its for insurance purposes in case they misuse the site" icon_rofl.gif

[Ken1015]

Identity theft is growing at an alarming rate. It's so bad that I can safely say that at least one of us will eventually fall victim to it. The latest method that identity thieves are using is known as "phishing," whereby the scammers send you an official looking e-mail from a large company requesting personal information.

This is a two part scam because it victimizes the companies as well as the individual. AOL, eBay, Citibank and others have been used. With the advent of this new scam people must be reminded never to give sensitive information in an unsolicited e-mail or to an unsolicited caller. If you do insist on giving personal info then you must assure that it is through a secure connection by checking for the "lock" icon on the lower right of your computer's taskbar.

[Wild i]

This is a cross-over issue (to other financial discussions held here), but stay away from Capital One and Household finance credit.

These are companies which garner a lot of business by offering 0% financing for a limited time, however penalties are quite steep. In the case of Capital One, they offer no grace period for payment, their late fee and over-the-limit fee are $29 each. I know of at least one person who was pushed over her credit limit because of late fees, sometimes as little as a few hours (less than a day) late. Now she can't keep up with the payments and even though she's no longer using the card, every months she's charged $58 in fees, plus interest. By the way, the interest applies to the part of the balance that's fees as well.

You'll find Household backing a lot of these "90 days same as cash" deals. What the don't say is that after 90 days, the entire balance is due or you'll have to pay exhorbitant interest (usually the max allowable in your state. In NY that's 25%).

I consider these scams as much as any pyramid scheme.

[Ken1015]

Originally posted by Wild i:
This is a cross-over issue (to other financial discussions held here), but stay away from Capital One and Household finance credit.

These are companies which garner a lot of business by offering 0% financing for a limited time, however penalties are quite steep. In the case of Capital One, they offer no grace period for payment, their late fee and over-the-limit fee are $29 each. I know of at least one person who was pushed over her credit limit because of late fees, sometimes as little as a few hours (less than a day) late. Now she can't keep up with the payments and even though she's no longer using the card, every months she's charged $58 in fees, plus interest. By the way, the interest applies to the part of the balance that's fees as well.

You'll find Household backing a lot of these "90 days same as cash" deals. What the don't say is that after 90 days, the entire balance is due or you'll have to pay exhorbitant interest (usually the max allowable in your state. In NY that's 25%).

I consider these scams as much as any pyramid scheme. What's in your wallet!? :D

[darrow]

Check out this article about a scam involving those Nigerian-please-send-money scams and a church in DC - SE Parish Divided in Wake of Scam (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A42060-2003Aug10.html)

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by darrow:
Check out this article about a scam involving those Nigerian-please-send-money scams and a church in DC - SE Parish Divided in Wake of Scam (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A42060-2003Aug10.html) Un****ing believable ! considering:


What seemed particularly unusual about this case, the government noted, was how someone of Daniels's background could fall for such a scam. After all, he worked as an assistant inspector general for the U.S. Department of Transportation until his retirement in 1998 and was certified as a fraud investigator. His job was to ferret out corruption and waste.

"It is sad and shocking that an individual with defendant Daniel's education, background and experience, as well as his strong ties to the church, would have engaged in the scheme detailed in this case," prosecutors wrote in court filings.

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by Ken1015:
Identity theft is growing at an alarming rate. It's so bad that I can safely say that at least one of us will eventually fall victim to it. The latest method that identity thieves are using is known as "phishing," whereby the scammers send you an official looking e-mail from a large company requesting personal information.

This is a two part scam because it victimizes the companies as well as the individual. AOL, eBay, Citibank and others have been used. With the advent of this new scam people must be reminded never to give sensitive information in an unsolicited e-mail or to an unsolicited caller. If you do insist on giving personal info then you must assure that it is through a secure connection by checking for the "lock" icon on the lower right of your computer's taskbar. I try to be very careful these days about giving out any personal information over the phone or over the internet. Peeps need to invest in a shredder at home for all the documents that they may throw away that have to much personal info on them. Just think if someone went thru your garbage what would they find ?

I worked with this guy once at a candy factory named Joe. We hung out went to some parties and clubs.. real nice guy. After loosing track of him for about 6 months, this University detective paid me a visit at my job :eek: . He asked could we go somewhere and talk. Of course as we walk to this room my mind is racing thinking what the **** did I do ? When we get to this room he pulls out this picture and asks me do I know this guy. I look at the picture and say " Yea, thats Joe. I used to work with him." The detective then told me a story about how Joe is not really Joe but had stolen someones indentity. The fake Joe had flunked out of school, ruined the real guys driving record and charged up all sorts of credit card debt. The detective was trying to help the real Joe out but was not having much success. He said that to prove that the real Joe did not do these things he has to produce the fake Joe. He said that he was recommending that the real Joe change his name to something else. :( This is definitely some serious shit.

-G

[ August 21, 2003, 10:00 AM: Message edited by: Gman ]

[Koffy Brown]

my sister is paying for this service...I need to get her this information...I'm just not big on generic type of anythings...so this type of stuff I don't even entertain, but I am curious has anyone ever used the services...I mean did you ever get the legal representation that you paid for...thanks for info G...

[imported_Gman]

My rule is "generally" speaking if you contact me concerning a product (insurance, investment,vacation..etc ) then its not going to be in my best interest. Most of the things that are good for me financially I have to initiate.

-G

[ August 21, 2003, 10:12 AM: Message edited by: Gman ]

[fred da warrior]

Originally posted by AshakiMzuri:
my sister is paying for this service...I need to get her this information...I'm just not big on generic type of anythings...so this type of stuff I don't even entertain, but I am curious has anyone ever used the services...I mean did you ever get the legal representation that you paid for...thanks for info G... I just used them to get an attorney, so I guess I am signed up. My particular situation was kind of desperate, and I didn't have the money to pay a lawyers regular rate/ retainer, etc. Supposedly depending on what kind of legal services you need, the attorney's fee are only $75 per hour as opposed to possibly 3-4 hundred that one would pay normally. My legal situation didn't fall under what was covered, so I wound up having to make a deal with the attorney they referred anyway. I just got the "offical" paperwork in the mail a couple of days ago, so I will take a look at it when I get home and see if I can contribute anything to the thread in terms of information.

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by fred:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by AshakiMzuri:
my sister is paying for this service...I need to get her this information...I'm just not big on generic type of anythings...so this type of stuff I don't even entertain, but I am curious has anyone ever used the services...I mean did you ever get the legal representation that you paid for...thanks for info G... I just used them to get an attorney, so I guess I am signed up. My particular situation was kind of desperate, and I didn't have the money to pay a lawyers regular rate/ retainer, etc. Supposedly depending on what kind of legal services you need, the attorney's fee are only $75 per hour as opposed to possibly 3-4 hundred that one would pay normally. My legal situation didn't fall under what was covered, so I wound up having to make a deal with the attorney they referred anyway. I just got the "offical" paperwork in the mail a couple of days ago, so I will take a look at it when I get home and see if I can contribute anything to the thread in terms of information. </font>[/QUOTE]Fred, please keep us posted as to your final opinion of this service.

-G

[imported_Gman]

Just some info I found on the web:


PRE-PAID LEGAL SERVICES:
PRE-PAID LEGAL SERVICES IS IDENTIFIED AS A PYRAMID SCHEME:
HOW THE SCHEME WORKS

by
Jarod Martin

Pre-Paid Legal Services, Inc., a Multi-Level-Marketing company, touts that it has been selling discounted legal insurance plans for over 25 years and that its Provider Law Firm network is comprised of tens of thousands of lawyers across North America. In the United States and Canada, alone, PPL has at least one million paying members. Now scores of sales agents ("associates") have taken to selling the company's services over the Internet as well as through personal connections.

Perhaps you're one of the many unlucky ones bombarded by email blasts from their agents.

There are certainly some good multi-level-marketing companies out there - they're the ones that push quality products or services over "business opportunities."

Pre-Paid Legal Services, Inc., on the other hand, appears to be a classic pyramid sales scheme.

Class action lawsuits are now pending from shareholders for deceptive reporting to the Securities and Exchange Commission and from sales associates for false and misleading claims about income potential. The company recently paid a fine to the state of Wisconsin for making false income claims.

If you're wondering how it works, Robert L. FitzPatrick, President of Pyramid Scheme Alert, was kind enough to lay it out for us.

"More than 50% of Pre-Paid Legal's customers and sales representatives quit each year." FitzPatrick went on to descibe the company, thus: "The pay plan is based upon continuous recruitment and is structured so that the top levels gain the majority of revenue. PPL has no sustainable customer base or sales organization. It is strictly a recruitment scheme.

According to PPL's 2000 Annual report, the company had paid out $139,891,000 in sales commissions over the past five-year period. The total number of people who have been PPL sales reps during this time is 472,189. That averages out to $296.26 per sales rep, per year, or $5.70 per week before taxes, training and other expenses are deducted. When training costs are deducted, the gross income average falls to $2.10 per week. In reality, the actual figure is far worse, since this "mean" average includes the huge incomes of the small number at the top. The majority of the sales reps never earn a penny of true profit.

As the customers and sales reps quit, those who have made some money by recruiting are charged back the loss of projected revenue.

In the last five years, more than 1/2 million people have signed up to be PPL sales reps. On average, PPL has a ratio of just 4 customers to each sales rep. The business is based not on sales, but on recruiting unwitting sales reps who do not understand the complex pyramid pay plan. This plan assures that only a small number of people can ever succeed."

[imported_Gman]

And another one:


PRE-PAID LEGAL SERVICES:
PRE-PAID LEGAL FACES LEGAL PROBLEMS ITSELF / MLM PLAN DRAWS FIRE
The News & Observer, Raleigh, S.C.

July 17, 2001
Author: Vicki Lee Parker ; STAFF WRITER
Edition: Final Section: Business Page: D1

In 1997, Richard Pucciarelli thought he was on the path to becoming a millionaire by selling legal services to consumers for a nominal monthly fee.

After all, that's what he said he was led to believe by the testimonials of sales associates at Pre-Paid Legal Services. But instead of making millions, Pucciarelli said he wound up paying Pre-Paid. In March, he filed a complaint with state Attorney General's Office accusing the company of fraud.

The Attorney General's Office has received seven complaints against the 29-year-old Ada, Okla.-based company, which has been recruiting sales associates and members in North Carolina since 1995. On the national front, the company is facing multiple lawsuits and appealing a recent ruling by the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission that it overstated its earnings.

Pre-Paid describes itself as a multilevel marketing company, which means that members pay a fee to join and then have an opportunity to make money two ways - by selling a product, and by bringing on board more fee-paying sellers. Multilevel marketing, also known as network marketing, is not illegal - Amway, a manufacturer and distributor of cleaning products, is one well-known company that uses such a structure.

Pre-Paid markets itself as an HMO for legal services. Consumers pay between $16 and $32.95 a month (the rate varies by state and by the type of plan chosen) for access to a lawyer in Pre-Paid's legal network. If they ever need the services of that lawyer, they will get a 25 percent discount on his or her fees, as well as certain free services, such as one phone call or letter a year.

Those services are sold by sales associates who are recruited at meetings held almost weekly at hotels throughout the Triangle.

The new recruits, who have heard about the company through friends, co-workers and fellow churchgoers, listen to testimonials from Pre-Paid associates and then are given an opportunity to pay $249 to become sales associates in Pre-Paid's network. Associates earn commissions on the memberships they sell and on the memberships their recruits sell. The more people an associate recruits, the more money he or she can make.

Richard Pucciarelli, who lives near Charlotte, went to such a meeting three years ago when he was living in Colorado and was hooked.

"When you are in the [meetings] long enough and people are telling you that they are making $10,000 a month in 10 months ... you start to think you have the same opportunity to make that money," Pucciarelli said.

Four weeks after attending his first meeting, Pucciarelli, a former chiropractor, became a Pre-Paid sales associate. Shortly afterward he moved to North Carolina, where he built a network of nearly 1,000 sales people. By the third year he was averaging $7,000 to $8,000 income per month from Pre-Paid.

But by his third year, something disturbing began happening: His commissions were decreasing. He said he learned that his sales income was being reduced by chargebacks resulting from membership cancelations.

The news disturbed Pucciarelli, who said he was told by Pre-Paid executives that he would start earning additional income from membership renewals after his third year. In fact, that was the main reason, Pucciarelli said, that he joined the company. Pucciarelli said he was told that Pre-Paid had an average annual membership "persistency rate" of 76 percent since 1981. The persistency rate does not reflect the company's actual membership retention rate, because it measures the number of members at the end of the year as a percentage of the total at the beginning of the year plus any new members who joined during the year. In other words, members who did not renew were offset by new memberships.

But a recent SEC filing by the company reported a much lower retention rate. After the first year only 53 percent of its customers remained. That dropped to 37 percent after the second year and to 29 percent after the third year. For Pucciarelli, this meant that instead of earning renewal income from 76 percent of his original members - as he believed would happen - he only earned renewals for about 30 percent. In addition, Pucciarelli had to repay the advance commissions - plus interest - he received on memberships that later were canceled.

"I accrued a debit balance at 9 percent interest," Pucciarelli said.

Pucciarelli and other sales people recently learned the true retention rate from an 8-K filing that Pre-Paid made to the SEC in January. An 8-K is a filing that companies make to disclose some material event or information.

"When I found this 8-K filling I was devastated," said Pucciarelli.

"We changed the disclosure this year somewhat," said Kathy Pinson, vice president and controller of Pre-Paid Legal. "After a lot of questions and comments and accusations came up this year, we gave a year-by-year membership persistency rate."

Pinson maintains, however, that Pre-Paid has always provided enough information in its earlier financial filings with the SEC for people to determine the retention rate on their own.

"You could calculate the number because all the information needed was there," she said.

Pinson said that under the old disclosure method, Pre-Paid "blended the new members and active members" - a practice that has led to one of the recent lawsuits against the company.

"Pre-Paid enlisted tens of thousands of salespersons or associates by deceptively stating that 76 percent of the memberships would remain in force," according to a lawsuit filed on behalf of all Pre-Paid's U.S. sales associates last month in state court in El Reno, Okla.

Two lawsuits also were filed earlier this year in U.S. District Court for the Western District of Oklahoma in Oklahoma City. One, on behalf of shareholders, accused the company of inflating its earnings and stock price. The other was filed on behalf of consumers who have bought Pre-Paid's legal services. Both seek class-action status. According to Ann Baskin, a secretary for the clerk of court in U.S. District Court for the Western District of Oklahoma, about 19 lawsuits have been filed against the company in federal court there. Those lawsuits have been consolidated into one and are still pending, Baskin said.

Pre-Paid officials contend that the suits have no merit. In a letter to shareholders, Harland C. Stonecipher, Pre-Paid's founder and chief executive, wrote that "there is not merit to the lawsuits" and "we do not believe that our accounting is in any way inaccurate, misleading or inappropriate."

Last month, however, the SEC found that Pre-Paid's accounting practices did not comply with generally accepted accounting principles.

According to the SEC, the company had overstated its earnings by counting advance commissions paid to salesmen such as Pucciarelli as assets rather than expenses. The SEC ordered the company to restate its 2000 earnings from $1.92 per share to 81 cents per share. Pre-Paid has refused to make do so while it seeks a meeting with SEC Chief Accountant Lynn Turner. Pre-Paid's stock dropped 26 percent to $14.10 after the SEC's restatement order. It has since climbed to close Monday at $17.56.

Pre-Paid is also facing questions at the state level in North Carolina.

"We are working to resolve the seven complaints we have received here at the Attorney General's Office regarding Pre-Paid Legal Services," said spokeswoman Julia White. White said she could not comment further about the complaints.

Among the complaints on file at the AG's office are those from members who complained of not receiving the legal representation that was guaranteed under their contract with Pre-Paid.

Belinda Brittain, owner of Brittain Academy, a private school in High Point, said in her filed complaint that after paying approximately $24 monthly for three years, Pre-Paid refused to write a letter on her behalf - a service she thought was covered by her premiums.

Brittain said Pre-Paid referred her to several lawyers - including one who requested an approximate $5,000 retainer - but all required a fee to write the letter. Brittain eventually sought legal help elsewhere. She said she paid a lawyer in High Point $500 to to write the letter. She asked Pre-Paid to refund the nearly $900 in premiums she had paid over the three-year period. "That should have been enough to cover one letter," Brittain said.

In its written response to Brittain's complaint, also on file in the AG's office, Pre-Paid stated that Brittain repeatedly declined to hire its attorney "at a reduced hourly rate," and that "We do not believe a refund is due."

Pre-Paid also wrote: "We felt that a letter would be damaging to her position if she failed to follow through and retain the attorney and pursue the issue."

"Generally, we are absolutely hands-on in addressing any complaints that members bring to our attention," said Martin Horn, partner with Browne, Flebotte, Wilson & Horn of Durham, the firm hired by Pre-Paid to administer legal services to members in the state. "We take those complaints seriously and do whatever we can to make sure these people are satisfied and are getting the service they desire."

The controversy surrounding the company has had little effect on its recruitment meetings.

George Tabb Jr., a high-level sales associate in Raleigh, was unaware of the SEC rulings or the company's change in its retention rate numbers. Even after learning of the charges and lawsuits, he remains an ardent supporter. He joined Pre-Paid 10 months ago after a former co-worker convinced him that he could more than double the $75,000 he made annually selling ads for the Yellow Pages. Tabb said he now earns an average of $10,000 a month selling individual memberships and recruiting people into his network marketing group.

"Look at Amway in the 1980s; they went through the same thing," Tabb said. "Today they are a company that offers a wonderful product. I think [controversy] comes along with growing pains." (Copyright 2001 by The News & Observer Pub. Co.)

[SuzanneT]

Originally posted by Gman:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by darrow:
Check out this article about a scam involving those Nigerian-please-send-money scams and a church in DC - SE Parish Divided in Wake of Scam (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A42060-2003Aug10.html) Un****ing believable ! considering:


What seemed particularly unusual about this case, the government noted, was how someone of Daniels's background could fall for such a scam. After all, he worked as an assistant inspector general for the U.S. Department of Transportation until his retirement in 1998 and was certified as a fraud investigator. His job was to ferret out corruption and waste.

"It is sad and shocking that an individual with defendant Daniel's education, background and experience, as well as his strong ties to the church, would have engaged in the scheme detailed in this case," prosecutors wrote in court filings.
</font>[/QUOTE]Hey Gman did you know that for the last 8-9 yrs most banks around the world will not accept any checks coming from Nigerian banks.
graemlins/jpshakehead.gif they are notorius for bank fraud.

As for pre-paid legal, i know some people affiliated w/ them and they get pissed because i call them pre paid pyramid, most people dont cases dont seem to qualify for the pre paid part and they have to end up coming out of pocket any way.

[Koffy Brown]

G...thanks a million for the info..
Fred...please keep us posted...

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by SuzanneT:
..... most people dont cases dont seem to qualify for the pre paid part and they have to end up coming out of pocket any way. graemlins/jpshakehead.gif

[fred da warrior]

G-Man,

Quick clarification after talking to the Mrs.:


I used a similar service (AmeriLegal), but I was about to use PrePaid (whew) because that was referred to me first. They both offer the same "discount" attorney services, though. I didn't choose PrePaid because they didn't cover my situation (neither did the one I chose), but given this valuable information, I certainly will do some investigation with this service.

A little information goes a long way.....Thanks.

[MusicFilter]

Originally posted by AshakiMzuri:
my sister is paying for this service...I need to get her this information...I'm just not big on generic type of anythings...so this type of stuff I don't even entertain, but I am curious has anyone ever used the services...I mean did you ever get the legal representation that you paid for...thanks for info G... This service is real, but the sales aspect of it is schiesty. The push is to get others under you to sell, something like Mary Kay Cosmetics.

I utilize a service similar to that here at the bank, I pay a fee each month and have a lawyer on call who will handle a number of things for me. He represented me on a $150 speeding ticket that he got reduced to $50 with supervision.

Some prepaid legal service is just a number where you can get legal advice or have them handle legal documents for you. They don't even show up in court for you.

The service I use is legit.

The guy that started that prepaid legal service has a book out that I found to be a good read.

[imported_Gman]

How about those of us who invest their 401(k) or 403(b) retirement saving plans in an insurance product like a Tax Sheltered annuity?

1. High upfront loads on the funds
2. High yearly maintenance fee's
3. Surrender charges
4. Mortality and risks expense (what in the phuck is that for?)

I started investing in my 403(b) a long time ago when a women from IDS financial services ( A division of some insurance company) cold called me and told me about the plan. They said they were working with the University (kinda true because they were an approved plan provider). So I signed up :rolleyes: . Once I got some knowledge I jumped ship after about a year and a half. I set up a 403(b) accounts thru the Uiversity with Fidelity and Troweprice. Note I had to pay a 7% surrender charge to IDS financial just to move my money (after 1.5 years I did not have that much invested so far so I ate the cost). Now I am not paying any load on the money I put in my mutual funds, I am also paying a lot lower yearly maintenance fees, there is no surrender charge if I want to move the money to someone else and there is no "mortality and risk expense". Now granted doing a retirement account with IDS was better than doing nothing but they were still scamming me on the expenses and charges. Again when someone cold calls you lookout !!

-G

[ August 21, 2003, 11:33 AM: Message edited by: Gman ]

[C hristian]

can we also discuss preditory lending?
Is this what Capitol 1 is all about?

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by chgodj3:
This service is real, but the sales aspect of it is schiesty. The push is to get others under you to sell, something like Mary Kay Cosmetics.

I utilize a service similar to that here at the bank, I pay a fee each month and have a lawyer on call who will handle a number of things for me. He represented me on a $150 speeding ticket that he got reduced to $50 with supervision.

Some prepaid legal service is just a number where you can get legal advice or have them handle legal documents for you. They don't even show up in court for you.

The service I use is legit.

The guy that started that prepaid legal service has a book out that I found to be a good read. From what I have been reading about this particular "Prepaid Legal Services" is that by the 3rd year 76% of their customers are no longer participating. Even though the service may be real it sounds like a lot of people are not happy with it. ;)

-G

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by C hristian:
can we also discuss preditory lending?
Is this what Capitol 1 is all about? You mean promotions like NO interest\ No payments for two years graemlins/OLA.gif

I've never done one but my guess is if you don't pay them in full on that due date (like you are really going to remember) then you are liable for all the back interest (probably at 20 something %). Anybody got the scope on these type of promotions ?

[ August 21, 2003, 12:01 PM: Message edited by: Gman ]

[imported_Gman]

Top 10 Internet frauds

• Internet auction fraud
Consumers say they've received an item that is less valuable than promised, or don't receive the item at all. FTC advice: Insist on using a credit card or escrow service.

• Internet service provider scams
Reports of being trapped into long-term contracts of ISPs with big penalties for cancellation. FTC advice: Read bills carefully for unexpected charges.

• Web site design/promotions -- Web cramming
Getting a custom-designed Web site for a 30-trial period could be more than what was bargained for. FTC advice: Review telephone bills and unfamiliar charges.

• Internet information and adult services -- credit card cramming
Using a credit card to prove being older than 18 years could prove costly. FTC advice: Always dispute charges that were unauthorized.

• Multilevel marketing/pyramid scams
Some multilevel marketing programs are actually illegal pyramid schemes. FTC advice: When products or services are sold only to distributors, there's no way to make money. Avoid plans to recruit in such a scenario.

• Business opportunities and work-at-home scam
Promises of earning "big money" while sitting at home are often too good to be true. FTC advice: Talk to other people who have dealt with the company or an attorney.

• Investment schemes and get-rich-quick scams
Making an initial investment in a day trading operation claims to offer huge returns. FTC advice: Always check with federal securities and commodities regulators to discover the level of risk.

• Travel/vacation fraud
The lure of a cheap trip with "extras" at a bargain-basement price often doesn't reveal hidden charges and additional requirements. FTC advice: References are necessary, as well as a written cancellation policy.

• Telephone/pay-per-call solicitation fraud
"Free" access to adult material and pornography by downloading a "viewer" or "dialer" program is cause for concern. Through the program, consumers reported their modem being disconnected, then reconnected to the Internet through an international long-distance number. FTC advice: Read phone bills carefully and don't download any program to access a "free" service without reading all disclosures.

• Health care frauds
Items not sold through traditional suppliers are "proven" to cure serious and even fatal health problems, but in actuality people lose money to these sites. FTC advice: Always consult a health care professional.


Source: Federal Trade Commission

[Koffy Brown]

Originally posted by chgodj3:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by AshakiMzuri:
my sister is paying for this service...I need to get her this information...I'm just not big on generic type of anythings...so this type of stuff I don't even entertain, but I am curious has anyone ever used the services...I mean did you ever get the legal representation that you paid for...thanks for info G... This service is real, but the sales aspect of it is schiesty. The push is to get others under you to sell, something like Mary Kay Cosmetics.

I utilize a service similar to that here at the bank, I pay a fee each month and have a lawyer on call who will handle a number of things for me. He represented me on a $150 speeding ticket that he got reduced to $50 with supervision.

Some prepaid legal service is just a number where you can get legal advice or have them handle legal documents for you. They don't even show up in court for you.

The service I use is legit.

The guy that started that prepaid legal service has a book out that I found to be a good read. </font>[/QUOTE]interesting

[Austin/Dallas]

Originally posted by Gman:
Top 10 Internet frauds

• Internet auction fraud
Consumers say they've received an item that is less valuable than promised, or don't receive the item at all. FTC advice: Insist on using a credit card or escrow service.

• Internet service provider scams
Reports of being trapped into long-term contracts of ISPs with big penalties for cancellation. FTC advice: Read bills carefully for unexpected charges.

• Web site design/promotions -- Web cramming
Getting a custom-designed Web site for a 30-trial period could be more than what was bargained for. FTC advice: Review telephone bills and unfamiliar charges.

• Internet information and adult services -- credit card cramming
Using a credit card to prove being older than 18 years could prove costly. FTC advice: Always dispute charges that were unauthorized.

• Multilevel marketing/pyramid scams
Some multilevel marketing programs are actually illegal pyramid schemes. FTC advice: When products or services are sold only to distributors, there's no way to make money. Avoid plans to recruit in such a scenario.

• Business opportunities and work-at-home scam
Promises of earning "big money" while sitting at home are often too good to be true. FTC advice: Talk to other people who have dealt with the company or an attorney.

• Investment schemes and get-rich-quick scams
Making an initial investment in a day trading operation claims to offer huge returns. FTC advice: Always check with federal securities and commodities regulators to discover the level of risk.

• Travel/vacation fraud
The lure of a cheap trip with "extras" at a bargain-basement price often doesn't reveal hidden charges and additional requirements. FTC advice: References are necessary, as well as a written cancellation policy.

• Telephone/pay-per-call solicitation fraud
"Free" access to adult material and pornography by downloading a "viewer" or "dialer" program is cause for concern. Through the program, consumers reported their modem being disconnected, then reconnected to the Internet through an international long-distance number. FTC advice: Read phone bills carefully and don't download any program to access a "free" service without reading all disclosures.

• Health care frauds
Items not sold through traditional suppliers are "proven" to cure serious and even fatal health problems, but in actuality people lose money to these sites. FTC advice: Always consult a health care professional.


Source: Federal Trade Commission Don't forget The

FREE CREDIT CHECK
and
FREE CREDIT REPAIR SERVICES

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by Austin/Dallas:
Don't forget The

FREE CREDIT CHECK
and
FREE CREDIT REPAIR SERVICES Please tell me how this scam works ???

[Discogoddess]

Originally posted by Gman:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by C hristian:
can we also discuss preditory lending?
Is this what Capitol 1 is all about? You mean promotions like NO interest\ No payments for two years graemlins/OLA.gif

I've never done one but my guess is if you don't pay them in full on that due date (like you are really going to remember) then you are liable for all the back interest (probably at 20 something %). Anybody got the scope on these type of promotions ? </font>[/QUOTE]I purchased furniture from Bay Furniture a few years back with this type of promotion, and was very happy with the experience. Of course, most of the reason I was happy with the experience is because I paid off the balance before the interest-free time period was up. Some interest-free or "same as cash" promotions allow the interest to accrue during the life of the promotion so that you are hit with the full amount of interest the day the loan comes due. Some only calculate interest beginning on the day the loan becomes due (if you haven't paid before then).

I think, as with anything, it's buyer beware when it comes to these kinds of promotions. WHY ON EARTH would you accept one or two years with no payments or interest and NOT make any payments during that time period? Don't people realize that they're going to get hit with the payments AND all that interest if they wait and don't pay before the loan comes due? graemlins/conf44.gif

[ August 21, 2003, 04:59 PM: Message edited by: Discogoddess ]

[Erob the One]

Man, don't sleepon the preditory lenders. The state of Illinois has a class action suit against household finance and they are paying dearly. On a side note, my aunt sued a preditory lending agency witht the help of some lawyers fro a legal aid system, and she got a fat check from them. The lawyers took the case without pay until it was settled. You can fight them if you been victimized.

True Story
I stopped at a gas station in Indiana on my way back to Detroit, and a guy pulled up in a grey Mercedes S class. I was pumping my gas and admiring his cars customization (walnut interior and AMG kit). He noticed this and gave me a tape on pre-paid legal services. The tape had all the usual success stories, but the bottom line was I had to give his code or something in order to get rolling. I have to admit, that it seemed like a good hustle but the pyramid is not good for me. I still have the tape for reference.

Erob

[Leslie]

The state of Georgia also has extreme laws with regard to predetory lending; aimed at subprime lenders.

[Hippie]

I don't know if anybody else has recieved this but lately I've recieved a couple of e-mails ( usually saying there from an african or an arabic nation ) stating something to the effect that current conditions have made them look for someone to collect money for them usually from an american account or wire transfering to your account and all they need is your bank account info, name, address etc....

I always just delete them but it's disturbing to think there may be people out there that would fall for something like this. So warn your relatives, friends and loved ones. Beware!!!

[imported_Gman]

So in summary lets be careful out there smile.gif

[P-Flipp]

Question everything, trust no one!Friends approach me all the time for all kinds of investment possibilities,I'm always cynical and wary.It's best to do as much homework as possible.

[imported_Gman]

Originally posted by P-Flipp:
Question everything, trust no one!Friends approach me all the time for all kinds of investment possibilities,I'm always cynical and wary.It's best to do as much homework as possible. But these are your friends, they do have your best interest at heart don't they ? smile.gif